continue

Seriously, can you make this readable?

DH can read it. Everyone can make an effort to read it. But you can't, because your not developed brain isn't good enough to figure out where a simple thing like a three words nickname begins.

Whoa, I did it before you even posted.

Ok, I cannot read that, but if you need our opinion on how the universe will end, I will give it.

The universe has a barrier that leads to somewhere, when the universe expands to a point where it starts goin inward, it implodes to make another big bang.

How can you not read that?

It's not /that/ hard.

Anyways, here's the mathematic definition of infinity:

in·fin·i·ty
–noun
the assumed limit of a sequence, series, etc., that increases without bound.

Therefore, if the universe continues to increase without bound, then it is infinite.

ggnore

Infinity: The word infinity comes from the Latin infinitas or "unboundedness." It refers to several distinct concepts (usually linked to the idea of "without end" or "bigger than the biggest thing you can think of") which arise in philosophy, mathematics, and theology.

:hmm: Our dictionaries do not match.

DragonHellfir3 (1:57:07 PM): Are you good at physics?
SwordsPwnYou (2:01:58 PM): sure, why not
DragonHellfir3 (1:59:38 PM): Is the universe finite?
SwordsPwnYou (2:02:26 PM): yes
DragonHellfir3 (1:59:54 PM): Like, is there proof, or is it just theory?
SwordsPwnYou (2:02:52 PM): we know the universe ends
SwordsPwnYou (2:02:56 PM): we know where it ends
SwordsPwnYou (2:03:08 PM): we don't know what's beyond that
DragonHellfir3 (2:00:44 PM): Is there something beyond it?
SwordsPwnYou (2:03:30 PM): probably not
SwordsPwnYou (2:03:34 PM): just emptiness
DragonHellfir3 (2:01:05 PM): Wouldn't that be part of the universe?
SwordsPwnYou (2:03:52 PM): the universe is matter
SwordsPwnYou (2:03:59 PM): for something to exist, it must exist
SwordsPwnYou (2:04:09 PM): so technically, anything beyond the universe doesn't exist yet
DragonHellfir3 (2:01:54 PM): :hmm:
SwordsPwnYou (2:05:22 PM): to understand the grand scale better we need more insight on the subatomic scale
DragonHellfir3 (2:02:56 PM): How do we know where it ends?
DragonHellfir3 (2:03:25 PM): How do we know it ends altogether?
SwordsPwnYou (2:06:14 PM): we can see where the stars stop
SwordsPwnYou (2:06:36 PM): but we also know that they're moving away from us
DragonHellfir3 (2:04:27 PM): What if stars just have a place where there aren't many left?
DragonHellfir3 (2:04:38 PM): And they start again further away
SwordsPwnYou (2:07:47 PM): gravity ensures semi regular distribution of mass in the universe
DragonHellfir3 (2:05:54 PM): What's outside the atmosphere?
DragonHellfir3 (2:06:01 PM): Immediately, that is
SwordsPwnYou (2:09:34 PM): what atmosphere, earth's?
DragonHellfir3 (2:07:05 PM): Any, don't care
SwordsPwnYou (2:09:45 PM): nothing
DragonHellfir3 (2:07:16 PM): No mass?
SwordsPwnYou (2:09:57 PM): except for maybe some scattered stardust
DragonHellfir3 (2:07:35 PM): So outside an atmosphere the universe doesn't exist?
SwordsPwnYou (2:10:46 PM): it's not verifiable without putting something there
DragonHellfir3 (2:08:36 PM): So does the universe end multiple times?
SwordsPwnYou (2:13:48 PM): the universe is all measurable space-time
SwordsPwnYou (2:14:06 PM): between masses, it's measurable, beyond, it's not
DragonHellfir3 (2:11:53 PM): So everything goes on forever? Otherwise it would be measureable
SwordsPwnYou (2:15:49 PM): I can't say whether "everything" in the broad meaning you use it is finite, but what you asked was if the universe was finite.
DragonHellfir3 (2:13:36 PM): I'm saying everything is the ultimate form. Absolutely everything.
SwordsPwnYou (2:16:22 PM): even nothing?
DragonHellfir3 (2:13:50 PM): Even nothing
SwordsPwnYou (2:16:36 PM): how would you define nothing then
DragonHellfir3 (2:14:13 PM): Nothing
DragonHellfir3 (2:14:27 PM): Has no mass


@Bizox:
SwordsPwnYou (2:23:24 PM): its growth is infinite, not itself
SwordsPwnYou (2:23:46 PM): plus he's using the mathematical definition

That's the philosophical definition.

This is physics, no? You said it was basic physics yourself. And physics is linked in many ways to mathematics.

I gave the mathematical definition. If we're looking at this from a physical and mathematical standpoint, then my definition is more correct than yours in this situation.

That didn't have to do with Physics...

The universe is either open or closed.

If it is closed, then where it ends is just simply a number that we do not know yet and we do not know what kind of matter ends our universe. In this theory, infinity is just another word fo a variable so vast, we cannot comprehend the number.

if it is an open universe, the universe will no longer sustain life when all the matter that make stars drift so far apart, they cannot join to make them, thus no sun for ET and his pals, thus no life.

There is no end of the universe because once you exit where matter has been, then you're placing new matter (yourself) there and that's expanding the universe to wherever you are. You could travel for an eternity constantly expanding the universe because the end is unreachable. If the end is unreachable then it's infinite. If the end is reachable but expands whenever something happens beyond it (be it ANYTHING that would allow ANY form of measurement) making it unreachable again. There is no way there can ever be an end because when we say there's a set end to it the end is already beyond that.

How can the universe not be infinite?

The universe is all measurably matter, so in a sense where we stop seeing/being able to measure matter is the end of the universe.

However it's impossible for the end to ever occur to anything, so it's infinite.

So your saying we say it's infinite because we have no technology to see beyond the edge of our universe.

There _can't_ be technology to see beyond the universe because whatever we're seeing is instantly becoming part of the universe. The universe does have an end, but it doesn't end.

I need a damn analogy.

We could call it the new found area of the universe.

What if there is nothing out there? What if the universe has not expanded to that point yet?

There _is_ nothing out there. However, there's also _nothing_ in between galaxies and such. The universe is everything that can be measured on one scale or another. Everything including nothing.

The new found area of the universe would still be the universe.

u·ni·verse
–noun
the totality of known or supposed objects and phenomena throughout space; the cosmos; macrocosm.

So technically I guess there can't be anything beyond the universe, by definition?

Perhaps there's another term that includes empty space, but I dunno what it is offhand.

3. The sphere or realm in which something exists or takes place.

it is simply a void

Well, nothing exists or takes place if there's...um...nothing there, so...>_>

Any contact with it makes something take place.

Okay, so if you're lookin' at it it's part of the universe, but otherwise it's not.

Still not quite infinite.

You could look beyond the universe. There will just be nothing there. But, like stated in DH's posted conversations, its growth is infinite, so there will eventually be something there.

Besides, like DH said before, if you go beyond where no other form of matter is measured, you, yourself, are expanding the universe, and will not reach an end. If you cannot reach an end, it is infinite.

It would be more interesting if people asked questions DH or Swords didn't already answer. All I am doing now is repetition.

Uh...if by that you mean that it doesn't stop expanding, then sure, yeah. But at any given point in time, it is indeed finite.

I don't see what you're trying to say there. >_>

You can't expand something that is infinite, by definition.

Just because we cannot reach it does not mean it does not exist.

But you're wrong, so actually all you're doing is confusing people. :hmm:

urp... BLARGH!!!

Hurray for poor communication! ^_^

Yes. Well, unless there's some inverse big bang or whatever that theory says. But yeah, for the sake of argument. However, that does not mean that it, itself, is infinite.

Yes. Same as above.

I'm pretty sure I did. >_>

Well, I just did, so...>_>

0_o

<3

Yeah, I just don't see any actual point being proven in your statement.

in·fi·nite
–adjective
1. immeasurably great: an infinite capacity for forgiveness.
l2define :|
Never reaching the end does not directly imply that it has no end; merely that you cannot detect that end.

Actually, technically you could measure the universe; well, hypothetically, anyway. It'd just be a pain. Also it'd be an incorrect figure momentarily, but that's not the point. >_>

That's the fun of it! >_>

:wub:

Do you guys ever watch the science channel?

http://i9.photobucket.com/albums/a80/Conno...20big20bang.jpg

Not necessarily. You couldn't "reach" the end at that point because you are the end.

I have a million other things to say to other posts in this topic, but I might wait and see if anyone else wants to keep going first.