yesterday I linked some stuff about Max Strauss, the philosophy grandfather of most the PNAC buddies.

http://www.yourbbsucks.com/forum/showthread.php?t=1347

Now- if someone may have the insight that the murder of nearly 3000 persons inside the US, two wars in the aftermath with hundreds of thousands of more deaths, even again US military personal, and the termination of civil rights is justified for the noble cause, named the ongoing way of capitalism based reign,

I can assure you: This is complete BS.

I met a few people in my life who know and understand how our system works completely and who accept all negative effects as given. Especially how our system tends to destroy itself.

War, greed, poverty, starvation, hunger, unemployment, environmental pollution, cyclic economic collapses, probably dozens more.

It't stunning.

And after all my research, that I'd begun with economically based knowlegde, I can proudly say: The driving force beyond all that we can see, even the noble cause bullshit, is the money.

"War is the best way to delay the upcoming catastrophe of the whole capitalism system again and again."
Ernst Winkler, "Theory Of Naturally Economic Order", Heidelberg, 1952, page 125.

And the money was no immovable, god-given destiny we have to accept, it was invented and created by our rulers.

The more easier way to go will be the change our economy-system, especially away from debt based; interest loaded fiat money which must increase the amount of debts necessarily every year, a growing debt that means ongoing slavery and burden for the masses while feeding the rich with power.

It's plain and easy. Stop using dollars or any other fiat currency money, because this is the how we support this weird and sick system. Let them know you know about their fraud, demand a stable maybe fee loaded currency, controlled by the people, in competition with other currencies, not a monopoly, highly inflated and without any real back up value besides fading trust and the force to use it for buying oil, and furthermore not created by politicians or bankers.

Please inform you. To name a few people you should know: Silvio Gesell, Bernard Lietaer, Robert Latham Owen, Gertrude Coogan, Eustace Mullins, James Voorhis, Stephen Zarlenga. Hans Eisenkolb.

If we can change this unholy power means, we can change the world. Or we have to bear the consequences...

I'd rather have people viewing "The Money Masters", a documentary about international banking that will alter your perception of reality forever. What it lays out might just be the root cause of the systematic madness mankind engages in, and after all, we should be looking for the perpetrators once we identified a crime, which I believe we sufficiently have already, shouldn't we?

Give it a go, it's well worth your time if only for the history lesson our educational system thoroughly fails to provide.
Lumos

http://video.google.com/videosearch?q=the+money+masters

Sittingbull,

I agree with you on the money part but I think racisim, in three forms, are used to justify fake terrorism which in turn is used to 're-shape' the world.

Read some of these quotes from our 'ally' leaders.

11. "We have to kill all the Palestinians unless they are resigned to live here as slaves." Chairman Heilbrun of the Committee for the Re-election of General Shlomo Lahat, the mayor of Tel Aviv, October 1983.

24. "One million Arabs are not worth a Jewish fingernail." -- Rabbi Yaacov Perrin, Feb. 27, 1994 [Source: N.Y. Times, Feb. 28, 1994, p. 1]

1. "There is a huge gap between us (Jews) and our enemies ­not just in ability but in morality, culture, sanctity of life, and conscience. They are our neighbors here, but it seems as if at a distance of a few hundred meters away, there are people who do not belong to our continent, to our world, but actually belong to a different galaxy." Israeli president Moshe Katsav. The Jerusalem Post, May 10, 2001

2. "The Palestinians are like crocodiles, the more you give them meat, they want more".... Ehud Barak, Prime Minister of Israel at the time - August 28, 2000. Reported in the Jerusalem Post August 30, 2000

3. " [The Palestinians are] beasts walking on two legs." Menahim Begin, speech to the Knesset, quoted in Amnon Kapeliouk, "Begin and the Beasts". New Statesman, 25 June 1982.

4. "The Palestinians" would be crushed like grasshoppers ... heads smashed against the boulders and walls." " Isreali Prime Minister (at the time) in a speech to Jewish settlers New York Times April 1, 1988

5. "When we have settled the land, all the Arabs will be able to do about it will be to scurry around like drugged cockroaches in a bottle." Raphael Eitan, Chief of Staff of the Israeli Defence Forces, New York Times, 14 April 1983.

Also, don't forget both the democrats and republicans prior to the 2000 presidential elections declaring the US to be a 'Judeo-Christian nation'. September 11th, 2001 was already in thge planning stages by then as evidenced by the Project For A New American Century's (PNAC) call for "A New Pearl Harbor'.

http://www.sonnet.com/usr/kidogo/coogan.html


Mysterious Moneychangers

FOREWORD to Money Creators
by former Senator Robert L. Owen*



To the American People:

It gives me special pleasure to have the opportunity to explain the principles and purposes of this book, written by Miss Gertrude M. Coogan of Chicago.

The facts that Miss Coogan was awarded a Master's Degree in Economics and Finance by Northwestern University; was for eight years a Security Analyst for The Northern Trust Company of Chicago; that from the beginning she had a deep desire to understand the fancied enigma of money, have given her great insight into monetary science.

The basic principles of monetary science are simple. Knowledge of the science has been made difficult by those who have converted these simple principles into an enigma. They have done so with ponderous volumes written on prices and on the processes of production, transportation, distribution and allied topics; weaving into the subject matter deceptive terms so that the public has been grossly misled by the use of words which contain accepted false premises.

...

The purpose of this book is to bring before the American people the knowledge that they must have regarding the nature and manipulations of their money system. In my opinion, America faces a crisis which may result in the loss of our Representative Constitutional Government unless every man and woman, rich or poor, young or old; doctor, lawyer, merchant laborer, educator, clergyman, social worker, society leader; will bestir himself or herself toward the problem of bringing the fundamental truths of monetary science to every fireside.

It is time for intelligent Americans to examine their money system .... Those who own insurance policies and savings accounts must bestir themselves to protect those accumulations. ...

... The truths themselves are very simple, but many of the newspapers and publishing companies allow themselves to be used to carry misinformation to the American public, while neglecting to print the truths. Honest money principles are understandable to every one when the money subject is presented in its true light.


....



*
The Foreword was written by Robert L. Owen, who, as Senator from the brand new state of Oklahoma and Chairman of the Senates Banking and Currency Committee, had been instrumental in the passage of the Federal Reserve Act 1913.

He spent the rest of his life trying to get it repealed.

THE FEDERAL RESERVE
by Jerry Voorhis

The Constitution of the United States says: "Congress shall have power to coin money and regulate the value thereof." Congress does no such thing, which is the heart of our trouble. Private banks coin our money and regulate its value. In doing so they take from the government and people of the United States a large chunk of their sovereignty, a large chunk of the taxing power, and the key to a prosperous economy without inflation.

For example, in testimony before the Banking and Currency Committee of the House of Representatives in 1935, Marriner Eccles, then Chairman of the Federal Reserve Board itself, said: "In purchasing offerings of Government bonds, the banking system as a whole creates new money, or bank deposits. When the banks buy a billion dollars of Government bonds as they are offered-and you have to consider the banking system as a whole as a unit-the banks credit the deposit account of the Treasury with a billion dollars. They debit their Government bond account a billion dollars; or they actually create, by a bookkeeping entry, a billion dollars."

Mr. Eccles' statement is exactly as true today as when he made it. Here is how it works: The private banking system of our country creates our money in the form of demand deposits on the banks' books. The reason it is able to do this is because no bank is required to have in its vault anything like the amount of money which its depositors think they have in the banks.

Banks are only required by the Federal Reserve System, which the banks are sure they own, to have in their vaults anywhere from $1 to $1.50 for every $10 of demand deposits on their books. Thus for every $1 or $1.50 which people-or the government-deposit in a bank, the banking system can create out of thin air and by the stroke of a pen some $10 of checkbook money or demand deposits. It can lend all that $10 into circulation at interest just so long as it has the $1 or a little more in reserve to back it up.

This is, of course, the "fractional reserve system" of banking. It is more or less controlled by the Federal Reserve System, whose only stock is held by the private banks of the Federal Reserve System. Not a single share of such stock is held by the government or people of the United States, although if "national sovereignty" means anything at all, these banks of issue should be the property of the nation.

But what actually happens when our government engages in deficit financing? The obvious way the government can get more buying power into the people's hands is by itself putting more money into the stream of commerce than it takes out in taxes. The tragedy of the situation is that, up to date, the only way our government has enabled itself to spend more money than it takes in has been by forcing this sovereign nation to borrow its own credit from private sources.

This has been true, despite the fact that if deficit financing accomplishes its purpose at all it will increase production and trade, enhance tax revenues, and broaden the base of government credit.

To the extent that government bonds are sold for cash to individuals or to institutional purchasers other than banks the government is taking out of circulation approximately as many dollars as it will put back in when it spends the money.

To accomplish its purpose, deficit financing must result in the creation of new money, and the use of it to increase mass buying power. Only if this happens will there be any stimulation of idle plants to go back into production, or more employment.

Under these circumstances what ought to happen is that the credit of this great nation should be drawn upon directly by the government-not that it should go more deeply into debt.

For the credit of this or any nation is squarely based upon and derived from the production of wealth by the nation plus the power of the government to tax. A nation like the United States thus possesses an almost unlimited amount of credit. Otherwise it could not possibly have persuaded investors to buy $480 billion of government securities.

By whatever percentage it can be anticipated that production and hence potential tax revenues will increase as a result of deficit spending, by that same amount the credit of the nation and its government will be increased. This same percentage of the volume of money previously in circulation should appear on the books of the Treasury as a credit entry to be drawn upon just like tax revenues. To do that would be nothing more than rational and proper bookkeeping. It would also be morally right bookkeeping. And it would make some sense of Mr. Nixon's "full employment budget" idea.

But this is not what happens at all. Instead the sovereign government of the United States goes hat in hand to the private banking system and asks it to create the new money that the economy needs. The government gives-the word is used advisedly-it gives to the banking system, including the Federal Reserve banks, government bonds, the debt of all the people. Interest-bearing bonds, that is, bonds bearing as high an interest rate under today's regime as the banks decide to demand. Else they won't buy the bonds. The banks "buy" the bonds with newly created demand deposit entries on their books-nothing more. It is fountain-pen money and considerably more inflationary than would be the same amount of dollar bills created by the government. The deposits the banks create with which to own the people's debt are backed by nothing except the bonds themselves! In other words, they are backed by the credit of the American people.

What the government has "borrowed" from the banks, what the people must for years pay interest on, is nothing more nor less than the credit of the nation, which obviously the nation possessed in the first place or the bonds themselves would be no good!

At long last, a few years ago the Federal Reserve made tacit acknowledgment of these facts. As a direct result of logical and relentless agitation by members of Congress, led by Congressman Wright Patman as well as by other competent monetary experts, the Federal Reserve began to pay to the U.S. Treasury a considerable part of its earnings from interest on government securities. This was done without public notice and few people, even today, know that is being done. It was done, quite obviously, as acknowledgment that the Federal Reserve Banks were acting on the one hand as a national bank of issue, creating the nation's money, but on the other hand charging the nation interest on its own credit-which no true national bank of issue could conceivably, or with any show of justice, dare to do.

But this is only part of the story. And the less discouraging part, at that. For where the commercial banks are concerned, there is no such repayment of the people's money.

When the commercial banks create money, as they do when they acquire government bonds, they levy a tax on every person in the United States. This is so because every new dollar that is created makes every dollar previously in existence worth somewhat less than it was worth before. This is the very heart of inflation.

It is also taxation without representation with a vengeance. Until this system is changed, our debt will continue to skyrocket without limit and the fixing of debt limits by the Congress will continue to be an exercise in utter futility.

What ought to be done?

Banks should lend existing money. But, as the Constitution clearly requires, the money (or credit) of the nation should never be created by any private agency, but by an agency of the nation itself. It is the duty of Congress to provide for this by a carefully drawn statute.

The stock in Federal Reserve Banks should be purchased by the government from their present private bank owners. The Federal Reserve should then become our national bank of issue. It should create reserve Bank Credit as it does now. But that credit should be credited to the United States Treasury, not charged against it and the people as debt. As much such new credit should be created each year as is needed to keep our economy running at or near capacity-and no more than that. A stable price level could result. Then and only then can we expect to overcome recessions, to put our people to work, and do this without the danger of inflation and the ever-increasing debt which are inescapable under the present monetary system.

-Jerry Voorhis, The Strange Case of Richard Milhous Nixon, 1973

HOW TO NATIONALIZE CREDIT . . . Congress [could] provide for governmental purchase of the capital stock of the 12 central Federal Reserve Banks from the member banks which now own it. This would cost $144,000,000 in round figures, and would correct the present anomalous situation of a privately owned bank of issue. The Federal Reserve Banks could then create money in the form of "Federal Reserve Bank credit" entries on their books just as they do now. A "National Credit Account" (in contrast to present national debt) could be established on the central banks' books in favor of the United States Treasury. To such an account would be credited each year such amounts of newly created "Reserve Bank credit" as would provide the increased purchasing power needed to maintain economic balance and a stable price level.

The Treasury would draw checks against their account and pay them out to those to whom the government owed money, thus getting it into the purchasing power stream. In this way the whole nation would derive the benefit from the creation of the additional supply of money which its own growth had made necessary. No interest bearing debt would be incurred, but only a bookkeeping transaction between two public agencies. Should inflation threaten so that it was desirable to reduce the volume of money in circulation, the process could be reversed and the Treasury could transfer a portion of its tax revenues to the central banks for cancellation and retirement of the requisite amount of money to restore stability.

-Jerry Voorhis, Beyond Victory, 1944

http://www.sonic.net/~doretk/ArchiveARCHIV...FedReserve.html

http://www.monetary.org/

http://www.transaction.net/money/book/

http://www.margritkennedy.de/english/articles/bernard.html

http://userpage.fu-berlin.de/~roehrigw/Welcome.html#english

I know, lot stuff to check out, but it should be the duty of every free mind in this world to examine our money system.

http://www.themoneymasters.com/


just adding if someone wants to buy the videos.

Full download of the Moneymasters:

http://madcowpolitics.com/documentaries.htm

just at the end of the site ( note: a lot interesting stuff over there! )


And, not to forget: Oldy, a life-long warrior for fair money:

http://www.sunshinecable.com/~eisehan/

HON. RON PAUL OF TEXAS
Before the U.S. House of Representatives

February 15, 2006


The End of Dollar Hegemony




http://www.house.gov/paul/congrec/congrec2006/cr021506.htm


Video link: http://www.lewrockwell.com/paul/paul303.html

http://www.neweconomics.org/gen/

welcome to nef (the new economics foundation).

nef is an independent 'think and do' tank. We believe in economics as if people and the planet mattered.

http://yamaguchy.netfirms.com/coogan_g/coogan_index.html

Money Creators


Who Creates Money ?
Who Should Create It ?



by


Gertrude M. Coogan

***

Full text download

http://www.deviantart.com/view/9410862/

Death and Taxes: A visual look at where your tax dollars go.

Most people are unaware of how much of their taxes fund our military, and those aware are often misinformed. Well here it is. Laid out, easy to read and compare.
With data straight from the White House.

Doin' a little education:


http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/089966661...5Fencoding=UTF8


None Dare Call It Conspiracy

by Gary Allen


This book has eight chapters:

One...Don't Confuse me with the Facts

Two...Socialism---Royal Road to Power For The Super-Rich

Three... The Money Manipulators

Four...Bankrolling The Bolshevik Revolution

Five...Establishing The Establishment

Six...The Rockefellers And the Reds

Seven...Pressure From Above and Pressure From Below

Eight...You Are the answer.


***

http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/089968324...5Fencoding=UTF8

Wall Street & the Bolshevik Revolution

by Antony C. Sutton

***

http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/094500153...5Fencoding=UTF8


Wall Street and the Rise of Hitler

by Antony C. Sutton


***

http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/093085292...glance&n=283155



George Bush: The Unauthorized Biography

by Webster Griffin Tarpley

***


All worth reading...

@ agent orange: thx for that tip.

***

F.I.A.S.C.O.: The Inside Story of a Wall Street Trader


Infectious Greed : How Deceit and Risk Corrupted the Financial Markets

both: Frank Partnoy

http://www.amazon.com/gp/search/ref=br_ss_...frank%20partnoy


I must admit that I only knew the first one,
but I think I'll order the second one, too.

Just one more for today, that I havn't read yet, but it sounds very compelling:

John Perkins: Confessions of an economic hit man

How the U.S. Uses Globalization to Cheat Poor Countries Out of Trillions


http://www.democracynow.org/article.pl?sid=04/11/09/1526251

amazing thread....long read for sure.

well worth a sticky i would imagine

SittingBull,

What is your opinion of this video:
http://www.itszone.co.uk/zone0/viewtopic.p...2eae5c52b2e42ca
"The Money Changers"

@ painter: I reconmend watching it. Everyone should.

All facts were well presented, as far as I can overlook.

@ constitution: believe me, it's worth a sticky. It's the answer for most of our time "problems".

a friend told me to read "confessions of an economic hitman". he said it was fantastic to read.

it doesnt need a second recommendation for me to want to read it but now i have one it will speed up my search to find it.

Very interesting, even if i didn´t understand a lot of it, but i´m gonna look at some of them again, my x girlfriend works for ICC bank as a currency trader , hopefully she can fill in the bit´s that baffeled me, i have my own business as an industrial window cleaner and i have a hard enough time working out my taxes at the end of the year .

Paul...

@ Paul: Don't be afraid of admitting non-understanding. As my personal hero, Robret Latham Owen said as early as 1932: They made it non-understandable on purpose. So most people are afraid to even look at this theme, and trust on "experts". Become an expert yourself. It's not that tricky.

As a short summary: There are two main problems with our money system nowadays and troughout history as well.

First: the positive interest. positive interest rates lead to:
-growth-force, escpecially debt-growth force. The interest that has to be paid on money isn't in the system, you have to create it first via fractional money, fiat money.
-Shifting from poor ( working class ) to rich ( propertied class )
Only the factor that someone owns a lot of money lead to gain of more money, where does this money came from?
Some call this the reign-factor. The money-system rebuilt the political reign system
- cyclic crisis and crashes
- even sometimes war
(please note that the positive interest was damned throughout most time of history, by all great religions, and even in ancient times as the holy bible (Leviticus/3.Mose 25) said it was known that positive interest was a problem: Hall- or remission year, don't know the exact english term, which means that every seven years all debts should be vanished, and every 50 years all the property should be given back to the originally owners)

Second: The fractional money itself, you can call it a fraud, the Moneymasters movie does an excellent job in explaining this. They issued just more money than existed as full money. Today it's even worse, they issue money without any backing. This process was a alchemic one- aka FIAT LUX, go ask all the people you know, I'll promise no one could explain it to you the right way.


You have to understand the problems with our money first before you can solve the problems. The links that I've brought promoted a fee loaded money.
In the golden middle age in europe, there was already a time with this kind of money- google brakteaten.
There are problems with this money,too, maybe they will escorting us all the time, but the main stress factors are solved, aka the growing force and the reign patronage.

I'm in this for over 5 years, I couldn't find a fault in this model so far.
Please feel free to aks me, I'm doing my best to explain it in english...

I just watcjhed the first 2 hours of "the moneymakers" and its blown my mind.

I knew money could just be invented by someone but the current system we use only profits the people who make up the figures in the long and short term.

I cant see how it would be possible to change this without completely cancelling the worlds debts and starting again with an interest free system. That would be world revolution!

Politicians cant change it because they are either in their pocket or in most cases seem to get killed for it.

I have another 2 hours to go so i still have lots to learn but damn this is intensely interesting stuff for me to sit through 2 hours of financial history over 2000 years. Insanity i tell yer!

Sittingbull,
Thanks ever so much for taking the time to explain, very much appreciated. To tell you the truth i´v learnt more in two month´s on this site than i have since i left school. i`m 36.

Thanks again,

Paul.

I know what you mean. Hell, I've never been interested in balancing my check book, so why should I be interested in economics? Now I'm beginning to understand why everything works the way it does: The 'dice' are loaded.

I just heard that prior to the 1991 US/Iraq war, Iraq had the highest standard of living of any nation in the Middle East. Saddam was put in power by the CIA and the US government gave him his WMD, including chemical weapons. However, he did not agree to allow the capitalists to take just anything and everything they wanted so long as they paid him off. Instead, he became an economic Nationalist and tried to build up the wealth of his own country and party. It was this, more than anything, that led to the first Iraq war and the sanctions which followed. Deciding to trade their oil in Euros instead of Dollars was the straw that broke the camels back. Saddam had to go.

You understand what I'm saying here: Even if we were able to establish our own economic system free of their banking control, we, such government, would be dealt with in exactly the same way as Saddam.

The appropriate question is: "With whose army?"

Its amazing since economics is one of the most studied topics of our time that more light has been shed on the catch 22 that is our economic system. Are their any economist here or anyone with knowledge about the subject. I am very curious how someone who is a professional in the field would respond to the video money masters or any of the topics disscussed on this board.

I doubt that I could convince the MBA that I know in my life to really look at The Money Masters. To his credit, he watched Loose Change....but if you think I am cynical, well....

He subscribes to the "Bush + Co., Pentagon are total incompetents."- Mind you, he does have more credibility (in my eyes at least) - he was an army officer during the late 60s and 70s, and he was a part of the strategic command- covering maintenance and supply logistics. He has pretty deep (and classified) personal experience on how badly these institutions can fuck things up.
Let's just say he has told me a few stories in strictest confidence which make me very grateful for the resilience and stability of nuclear weapons as compared with conventional explosives.

The Perils of Economic Ignorance
by Ron Paul R-Tx

March 27, 2006

Last week in this column I wrote of a perfect economic storm facing America, caused by a federal government that spends, borrows, and prints so much money that our dollars are eroding in value at an alarming rate. Year after year our federal government spends beyond its revenues, prints new money to pay its debts, and borrows hundreds of billions abroad in the form of Treasury obligations that someday must be paid. With too many dollars and debt instruments in circulation, and no political will in Washington to cut spending, we've created a monster. Our perceived prosperity depends on keeping the great debt and credit engine pumping, but the only way to attract new lenders to fuel the engine is higher interest rates. At some point one of two things must happen: either the party in Washington ends, or the supremacy of the dollar as the world's reserve currency ends. It's a sobering thought, but a choice must be made.



How did this happen? How did we get to such a state? The answer is found in the nature of politics itself. The truth is that many politicians and voters essentially believe in a free lunch. They believe in a free lunch because they don't understand basic economics, and therefore assume government can spend us into prosperity. This is the fallacy that pervades American politics today.



I believe one of the greatest threats facing this nation is the willful economic ignorance of the political class. Many of our elected officials at every level have no understanding of economics whatsoever, yet they wield tremendous power over our economy through taxes, regulations, and countless other costs associated with government. They spend your money with little or no thought given to the economic consequences of their actions. It is indeed a tribute to the American entrepreneurial spirit that we have enjoyed such prosperity over the decades; clearly it is in spite of government policies rather than because of them.



I certainly have seen firsthand a great deal of economic ignorance in Congress over the years. Few members pay any attention whatsoever to the Federal Reserve Bank, despite the tremendous impact Fed policy has on their constituents. Even many members of the banking and finance committees have little or no knowledge of monetary policy. Perhaps this is why so many in Congress seem to believe we can all become rich by printing new dollars, or that we can make 2+2=5 by taking money from some people and giving it to others.



We cannot suspend the laws of economics or the principles of human action any more than we can suspend the laws of physics. Yet this is precisely what Congress attempts to do time and time again, no matter how many times history proves them wrong or economists easily demonstrate the harms caused by a certain policy.



I strongly recommend that every American acquire some basic knowledge of economics, monetary policy, and the intersection of politics with the economy. No formal classroom is required; a desire to read and learn will suffice. There are countless important books to consider, but the following are an excellent starting point: The Law by Frederic Bastiat; Economics in One Lesson by Henry Hazlitt; What has Government Done to our Money? by Murray Rothbard; The Road to Serfdom by Friedrich Hayek; and Economics for Real People by Gene Callahan.



If you simply read and comprehend these relatively short texts, you will know far more than most educated people about economics and government. You certainly will develop a far greater understanding of how supposedly benevolent government policies destroy prosperity. If you care about the future of this country, arm yourself with knowledge and fight back against economic ignorance. We disregard economics and history at our own peril.

http://www.house.gov/paul/tst/tst2006/tst032706.htm

before I took the red pill I used to hate all republicans.

i hated them for no political reason other than tipa gore's censorship attempts.

Since I took that red pill I immediately found two republicans who defied the blackout on the Patriot Act and asked questions b4 it was passed. these two went on to talk against the bill. I admired this greatly. I would therefore not tar all republicans with the same brush again.


Ron Paul is speaking so much sense here i got to admire him for it. As someone previously said I dont even balance my cheque book why should I care about economics.

Now I do. i have baffled people with how the system works from only a few hours studying. I met one guy who knew what I was talking about and we mirrored our view without any previous economic discussions. ppl musta thought we were a right drag. Honestly tho I think this is a vital peice of knowledge to learn. and learn it young.

I have learned so much also, and they say its hard to teach an old dog new tricks.

@ constitution, Zor: I'm glad to hear that. But please do not overestimate my part on that.

The praise belongs to you, because you are the ones with an open mind and with the will to request this topic. :)

@ Zor: Hard to teach an old dog new tricks? :lol:
Quite interesting, especially while I'm only 29... ;)

I know I just hit 30 a few months back. I clearly had my head in my rectum since I can remember.

Just another lame brain brought up on the brainless tube.

Ever wonder why economists are always emphasizing growth? Why cant we just be a stable economy? The reason is because the Federal Reserve system is a pyramid scheme. If it is not fed by constant growth it collapses. The banking families have sucked trillions of dollars worth of wealth from us via the Fed. Just google "waddesdon manor" to see the type of places the Rothschilds have been buiding for themselves these last 200 years with the money from the central banks of the western world. Almost every country in the world has a Rothschild controlled central bank. Afghanistan and Iraq were 2 out of 7 that didn't. Iran, North Korea and Venezuela and among the few others that dont. This is why they speak out against Israel and the US, they are the only free countries in the world who's press is not owned by the Jewish banking families. For all our talk of "free press" no one dare mention the Federal Reserve system.

NSF fee: $35

Elaborate Fountain Sculpture: 2.65 million

Being Able To Print Money And Charge The Government 90 Cents On The Dollar For It:

PRICELESS.

the massive interest secures the growth. As soon as the government trades bonds for extra economy over what the internal revenue is its gonna hatfa borrow more if they dont keep a solid budget to contrast the interest payments.

So as soon as you get to a point where your economy is gonna crash what do you do? Force the banks to fund your wars and hope they pick you to win.

the banks fund everyone in wartime and know who is gonna win.

The winner then takes control of the economy of the conquered.


I want someone to explain how this is a good system. A system of choice by the elected representatives.


I might hatfa read more about Venezuela because I believe its on the agenda so they can control the output of its oil. Once they "secure" Iraq and move on they can only desire to control the flow once more.

umm....man i confused myself now...finance is like a spiral of decline fed by people who cant even say "budget" without moaning.

Sorry if some links and hints are already mentioned here:

This is my 101 on the money issue:

As long as we have debt based interest loaded fiat currency all over the
world, we will have the same old problems.

My sources: Congressman Jerry Voorhis, Out of debt, out of danger. 1943.

http://www.noontidepress.com/catalog/produ...products_id=149

Gertrude Coogan: Money Creators. 1935. with a forword of Robert Latham Owen,
Sen. and chairman senate financial and currency committee 1913 at the time
of the Fed act.

http://yamaguchy.netfirms.com/coogan_g/coogan_index.html


He himself wrote the book: The federal reserve system. Back in 1919.

http://bioguide.congress.gov/scripts/bibdi...l?index=O000153

Later he changes his mind completely:

http://www.sonnet.com/usr/kidogo/coogan.html


Stephen Zarlenga: Lost science of money.

http://www.monetary.org/lostscienceofmoney.html


Silvio Gesell: Natural economic order.

http://www.systemfehler.de/en/neo/

Bernard Lietaer:

http://www.transaction.net/money/bio/lietaer.html

http://www.transaction.net/


And the movie: The Money masters.

http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=8442305921010099392

http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=5020331178524208549

http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=3510313821923167501


Also check out "The Creature from Jekyll Island."

http://digital-mixes.com/BONA/Creature.mp3


I know, a lot of stuff. But money is the core of our problems.

Notable quotes about fair money

http://www.freemarketnews.com/Analysis/78/...wid=78&nid=5248

Rec'!

"Paper money has had the effect in your state that it will ever have, to ruin commerce, oppress the honest, and open the door to every species of fraud and injustice."

George Washington, in letter to
J. Bowen, Rhode Island,
Jan. 9, 1787

Can I still write checks? :lol:

Good post.

Dirty Secrets of the Temple - How the Federal Reserve Runs the US


http://www.informationclearinghouse.info/article13833.htm

I met Bernd Senf yesterday, a professor of economy here in Berlin, Germany.

He gave the tip to study Frederick Soddy: "Wealth, virtual wealth and debt. The solution of the economic paradox"

I look for it on abebooks, but it was too expensive for me. :(


***


BTW: Have you ever heard of an attempt to pass another form of currency in the US?

http://userpage.fu-berlin.de/~roehrigw/fis...stamp-ap-6.html