Hi all,

My first post on this forum, so I thought I'd tell you about my burgeoning Imperial Guard project, the VIIth Surrian Janissaries.

My intention is to put together a few units (I dont play any more so I'm going for the units I would like to build rather than necessarily building a legal army) with a distinctive Pre-Heresy theme and appearance. Although the armies not built for gaming, I'll follow the Codex as much as possible in terms of the units I put together. In terms of Pre-Heresy stuff, I've had a few threads going at other sites which have thrown up lots of possibilities (particular thanks to Eisenhorn for his pms!), so I've pretty much worked out what to include/exclude from my list at this point.

The basic infantry models will be cadian plastics with Empire pistolier heads (feather removed) and greenstuffed great coats.

Officers will keep the pistolier feather on their helms, and I may also go with a breastplate body (Pistolier or Knightly Order) to help them stand out from the common troopers. I may also look at the number of feathers on the helm being an indicator of rank (I'll make a decision on this once I get hold of some heads).

Roughriders will be as per the officers, with a high collar and Knightly Order arms and lances to give them an armoured, antiquey look. Horses will be the Pistolier horses, possibly with some armour added.

I'd like to do the heavy weapons teams as gun-carriages, but this largely depends on whether I can get hold of the necessary bitz cheap enough.

Tank-wise, I'll be going with basic Russ variations, plus tanks like the Malcador that have that nice old-fashioned appearance about them. Transports will be chimeras, though I may include a command rhino if I can get one cheap as a nod to the Rogue Trader guard lists. Vehicles aren't on the "immediate to-do" list, so there may be changes of plan as units form and ideas develop.

Currently waiting for bitz to arrive from ebay so I can get started, but once they arrive, I'll start posting some photos as and when I have them.

BTW, if anyone has any Knightly Order lance arms or pistolier heads or horses going to waste, please pm me - maybe we could work out a deal...

Welcome to the forum man!

I like the concept you have going there, it should look great (take pictures! we live off pictures here... :D )

Apparently, plastic greatcoat guard are on their way from GW. Not too sure about the timing though, so they may be a long way off...

BOLS

You could maybe use the old thudd gun carriage for them. EBAY thudd guns

Can't wait to see the first WIPs! Keep us posted (please :D ).

Thanks for the welcome, its a nice looking site here and I'm looking forward to getting involved.

I'd heard the rumour about the greatcoat plastics - I think I heard last quarter of 2008 as a prospective release date, so if I'm still going with these guys when they come out, maybe they'll fit in nicely.

And those thudd gun carriages do look like a good option, as do ork zapp gun carriages... we'll see.

The parts I'm waiting for are heavy weapons bits and pistolier heads so chances are they'll be the first WIPs I post. I really want to crack on with some roughriders as I see them as being a major unit in the army, but they'll keep until I get some horses (and figure out how to model an explosive tip onto the Knight lances...).

Interesting idea.
Can't wait to see some mock-ups and models.

What will their colour scheme be like?

And don't forget, Pre-Heresy the Imperial Army had Land Raiders, so maybe you could have one or two as command tanks.

Aye welcome to the site mate.

This seems like a brilliant idea, looking forward to seeing how you execute it. You might want to look at using the Cannon/Mortar boxed set from the Empire for your Heavy Weapons Teams they have wooden wheeled gun carriages which might be easier to hook up to horses.

Come to think of it, gagoc, you're right. They also had rhino chassis tanks/transports as well didn't they?

I'd have thought that just bulking up the spear tip (either as a cone or something more cylindrical) would work just fine. You could go the orky route though and add dynamite sticks strapped on... :D

Oh yeah, forgot about the colour scheme...

Cream greatcoats, silver helmets (and breastplates and armoured arms) and for the Cadian chest armour/shoulderpads... I'm thinking a darkblue/grey but I'm open to suggestions on this.

I want them to look like they are part of an expeditionary force, so they are wearing impressive dressy coats and armour rather than tactically sensible camo. Its all about making that first impression on the denizens of a newly discovered world.

Very true - perhaps a command landraider would be more impressive than a command rhino, particularly Goth-ed up with some bits from the Cities of Death sprues... A centrepiece model for the army. Nice idea, thanks. :) Especially if I went for Mk.1 version like the Forge World model...

Thanks. I'll definitely check those empire bitz out - I suspect they'll be more likely to turn up cheap than the metal thudds and zapps.

Yeah, I definitely want to work a little detail in there, without going OTT. I've got a bunch of marine grenades that might work... I'll have to have a delve through my bitz and see what I can find that wont overload the lance tip.

You might want to look into using the Bretonnian lances, they're broader at the tip and so'd be more receptive to getting stuff stuck on them without looking silly.

Sounds cool, can't wait to see some pics!

Does anyone know if there were ever rules published for roughrider platoons as opposed to individual Fast Attack choices? I'd like to do a couple of units plus a mounted Command Squad to lead them if possible, and it'd be nice to know that they would still be game legal. Perhaps as a doctrine?

The Forgeworld Imperial Armour book 'Siege of Vraks Pt1' has rules for Rough Rider platoons... it's quite pricey though! If you're interested, it is one of the few FW products I can actually get cheaper than RRP.

Thanks Shroud, pm sent (but ignore the bit about whether or not its an IA book - it clearly is, as mentioned in your post :rolleyes: ).

Minor update, but an important one none-the-less.

Feeling totally inspired by Rudolf the Red's 59th Expedition Force, I've decided to combine my Surrian Janissaries and Beastmen platoon ideas into a single project, namely an Expeditionary Force.

This means I get to do lots of different stuff as mini projects all under the one Expedition Force banner. So in theory, I'll never get bored! :D

Fluff and stuff will come later, but my intention is to represent the following elements of the Force:

- a PH Marine Legion (havent decided which yet - possibly Word Bearers cos I've always had a soft spot for them)
- a titan force (probably with Epic scale titans)
- a couple of different Imperial Army regiments (definites at this point are my Surrian Janissarys, which will be largely roughrider based, a human-led beastman regiment and a platoon of ship-based boarding troops).
- some of the Expedition Fleet personnel - high ranking Army and Astates officers, key flagship personnel, remembrancers & iterators)

Units currently slated for production - Surrian cavalry, couple of squads of beastman infantry (including chain weapon wielding Hardened Vets, standard infantry and ungor conscripts led by Commisars), and at least one Defiler-based stalk tank.

Soon as I get the bits I'll open a proper member log and start posting pics.

Mini update - got myself a box of pistoliers and a box of cadians today, and with a small bunch of beastmen arriving tomorrow Im looking forward to making some progress with my first Expedition units. The only models I'll be able to get close to finishing at the mo will be a few of the beastmen and their human command squad, as I'm waiting for some Knight lance arms to come from America to go with the roughriders, but I'll be able to start modelling some horse armour and rider bodies at least.

Interestingly the guy in GW Bournemouth hinted at Imperial Armour 6 having more info for "renegade"ish guard armies that he thought might be suitable for what Im putting together. If anyone can expand on this rumour, please shout.

I can't say I've heard the rumour, but considering the new traitor guard models they're bringing out, I wouldn't be surprised.

Can't wait to see those beastmen man, hurry! :D

I'll do my best! :)

When you say traitor guard, do you mean the renegade militia, or some new ones that havent come out yet? IF the latter, any links?

The former. They are traitor guard for all intents and purposes...

Gotcha. Thought that was what you meant, but wanted to doublecheck just in case.

Gagoc:

Could you tell me where this information comes from; as I have not heard of that before? Its certainly not somthing that I remember reading about in the books.

Possibly old fluf Vesp, I remember hearing that too, untill during the heresy when the Emperor decreed that they should be astartes only.

Thanks Lion, sounds like an interesting possibility.

When Warhammer 40,000 Rogue Trader came out, Imperial Guard units could use Rhinos and Landraiders, but that was set in the 41st Millenium and has long since been retconned.

With regards to the current and accepted background of the Heresy, I do not recall any written description, or piece of artwork, which would suggest that the Imperial Army had access to such vehicles: which is why I am so interested to find out.

EDIT: I have found the reference in Index Astartes III, P. 58. However the absence of this detail in descriptions of Imperial Army forces in any of the books thus far, makes me wonder whether it is still part of the background of the Heresy or somthing that has been retconned. My own personal feeling is that the absence of descriptions of Imperial units using Landraiders, means that they now, did not use them during the Pre-Heresy period.

I'm 99% certain there is a throwaway comment about Land Raiders full of IA troops in one of the first HH novels... I remember at the time being a bit freaked out by it and re-reading it to make sure I hadn't misunderstood.

You might be thinking of Galaxy in Flames where Eiolodon and his marines rush forward in hundreds of Land Raiders...
Personally, I'd say it's fine to use land raiders, and if it isn't exactly fluff-accurate, you can make a backstory or an allied legion to make up for it

Right chaps, got some bits through the post today and I now find myself with enough cadian bits to make the best part of 18 heavy weapons teams and two squads of infantry (give or take), and absolutely no idea what to do with them.

My initial plan was to have them as the foot sloggers of my Surrian Janissaries, but I now feel that the Surrians will be good as a purely mounted regiment, and I could do my foot soldiers as something different.

Question is, what do I do?

So Im looking for inspiration - any ideas you might have that would make for an interesting theme for a regiment, sling them out so I can scour your brilliance for my Imperial Army troopers.

My first instinct is to build around the heavy weapons platoon - a regiment renowned for playing a supporting role on the battlefield with platoons of heavy weapons troopers. But what about their appearance?

Im open to all ideas so dont be afraid to throw out whatever comes to mind.

Cheers,

Anodyr

I had similar problems, which is why I made my Tharn IV garrison full of conscripts! :D

Heavy Platoons sound fun, be sure you either find a way to boost the BS or use weapons with high rates of fire (autocannon, heavy bolters).

Have you used the 'economical' method of making Cadian HW teams? Each set (1 HW sprue, 1 Cadian crew sprue) can be stretched to make THREE teams - one tripod weapon, one mortar, one missile launcher - by using standing poses as much as possible from the normal Cadian sprues. I bought the Battleforce box and 3 Heavy Weapons Teams, and I've made TEN teams and still going strong with the spare bits!

Actually I did have that in mind - I know theres a guide somewhere on t'internets that describes exactly how to do it, so if anyone nows where it is that'd be very handy. What I've got iss a bit of a mixed bag of bits off ebay - 4 lascannons, 4 auto, 3 hb, 3 mortar, 3 missilelaunchers, 3 trips, 2 bips and a few sandbags (no bases yet, but I'll sort that) plus a good few bodies, legs, arms and accessories, so I'll have to do some improvising, although I may use some of the guns for plasticard tanks...

Regarding heavy weapons teams, you can be very cheeky and do what I did for my Lamb's Worlder XXVII to further stretch them:











etc.

Those are really nice Apologist - great colour scheme and paintjob! And thats a nice trick for using the heavy weapons...

I can feel the inspirational juices starting to flow - keep the ideas coming! :D

I agree. That is really a clever and simple solution to the whole "I've got loads of heavy weapons left over" problem.

Nice one Apologist. Almost made we want to buy more stuff!! :D

If you've got loads of heavy weapons left over, why not try them in other places? (Ah loves me them autycannons, paw!

Sentinels are good:




...and ogryns are fun, too:

:lol: Somebody forgot their sun cream! Nice army man!

Those ogryns are awesome - and my first thought was "probably a desert planet - SUNBURN!!" :D

I actually prefer the converted ogres to the official recent ogryns.

The mental gears are ticking over, and Im starting to think "heavy infantry" - big plates of plasticard bodyarmour, bulky and unsubtle... if I go this route I'll definitely consider trying to truescale my Thousand Sons to make them stand head and shoulders above the army troopers.

P.S. The ogryn with rebreather/gasmask reminds me of the ancient 40k zoats - Im sure one of them had a mask like that...

Cheers guys, I was pretty pleased with the sunburn effect – skin's my favourite thing to paint. Check out the vest mark!

(last thread-jack, I promise!)

Are you limiting yourself to GW figs only? If not, I can really suggest the Pig Iron troopers. The Kolony range have really taken off amongst 40kers owing to their price (cheap as chips!) and the cool trenchcoats. However, the original range of sci-fi troopers is still pretty unknown, and I get some really positive comments on them. These are from Vedder's Vultures, a mechanised line regiment.



They'd look fun painted in greens too... for obvious reasons ;)

Yeah, I've seen the pigiron stuff, and been tempted... but for these Im goingt o stick with GW (I think). The look I'm thinking of is much less futuristic as I dont imagine the Imperial Army having particularly advanced looking kit in M31 (despite the pics of cadians in the Collected Visions) - I'll try and knock something up tonight and see how it comes out. Watch this space...

Just come across this forum. looks like PH guard could do with a bit more support...

Some really nice stuf there from Apologist - some of the best desert/modern themed guard i've seen and those ogryns are a real treat!

Regards the OP: Seems a big force of Rough Riders are likely to be costly and time consuming to get together - also maybe tricky to play (tho a lot of fun methinks). Seems having a small force of infantry as filler in the mean time might be a sound idea, or:

-Light infantry support - effectively the "dismounted" Rough Riders that have got there first. So an infiltrating type unit/platoon or convert as veterans in same role. Missile launcher teams would fit this - maybe even model a spare horse with extra ammo bags?
-Some form of mechanised infantry that keeps with the PH theme - maybe some real world vehicles?. Early guard had tunneling vehicles, they even modeled them for epic and that could work with a drop troopers type theme and offeres possibility of a really fun chimera conversion.
-Use the spares to convert up the rough riders - legs prob not too hard to do from knights or such with green stuff but using the bodies and arms might save you a lot of time/cost on ebay. Lances prob not too hard to do with metal rods and spares.

I picture PH guard armies as being huge and uniform but a rough rider regiment would likely be a lot more individual - and coulour scheme thoughs yet?

I'll stop at a couple of platoons of roughriders rather than going for a whole army - like you said it could prove rather costly to build unit after unit of these guys. The infantry will come in the form of my beastman regiment platoons.

Thankfully I've managed to source a lot of the components I need via ebay, and without costing too much either whcih is good.

As for colour scheme, Im going with cream greatcoats, silver/boltgun metal helmets, arm armour and breastplates, and grey body armour for those without the fancy breastplates. I really ought to try and get one model complete just so I can try out the colour scheme - maybe tonight...

Sorry it's taken a while to get back to this question (It took a while to hunt the info down, and then I forgot it was asked about here).

It's the same background piece Anodyr found in IA book 3(?)

I find that it's a good idea to have more than one source for background information, if you don't have one you might have the other. Same goes for access.