Please keep this thread flame-free. I only wanted to post the following as the other thread got locked as I was posting- which I'm not sure why it did, because the public should be allowed to voice their opinions on the battle. Isn't that the way every battle is run?

Anyway,

To judge 3:

All I'm going to say is that those three ratings were skewed. They should be within +/- 1 at most.

A -3 difficulty rating implies completely different skill levels, as Zombo pointed out. LB was able to perform a difficult combo smoothly. Also, consider the length of the pen LB was spinning and the length of the pen 000 was spinning. Do you think the 000 would be able to do the bak fall and other tricks if he were to have used a pen similar in size to bojo's. This is why the difficulty rating of -3 is ridiculous.

A -2 variety rating is somewhat of an unfair "penalty" that's tacked on because of the terseness of LB's combo. He obviously can't include many different tricks in a mere 6 seconds. In light of this, the variety rating should've been -1 or so if you were going to hand it out.

As for creativity, how many times have you seen that unique linkage of palm spins and other tricks? Now how many times have you seen the bak fall and fundamentals in recent times? Yeah, that's what I thought. Creativity is something LB apparently dominated in this battle, yet he was only awarded +1 in this category. This rating is incongruous with the others.

Whether LB or the 000 won might be difficult to judge, but I'm only going to state that judge 3 is biased toward bojo's style or hates bojo (or both).

this thread will be filled with flames soooooo fast.

u mean against.



other than that, thats exactly what i woulda said if i wasnt too lazy to type it all

Yeah sry 'biased against'; I typed that post kinda fast.

who cares, theyre going to let him rechallenge & hes obviously going to win this time. why start a big doodoo thread about it? eburt recognized that something was wrong & its getting fixed, its over

eh, sorry if you felt locking it was innapropriate. I just wanted to avoid flaming, that seemed to be coming quickly. So long as this stays flame-free, I encourage discussion.

Edit: He's not "obviously" going to win this time either. Just because last battle didn't work so well, does not mean he will be getting any favors. If he wins, he deserves it. If he loses, he deserves it.

Edit again: I don't know why this thread got locked for a second there... please keep it open unless it becomes a flame-fest.

i must say... after watching the vids again, i think the 000 deserved to win.... the 3rd judge was still rediculous though....

As much as I idolize lordbojo, I think it would be a tie, perhaps leaning towards the 000. His combo was difficult and smooth, but you can't possibly deliver healthy psing goodness in such a short video.

7 seconds was an average length in UPSB... limit for videos were always like 15 secs max

the idea is to show your new tricks with a few filler tricks to "prepare" and that's it.

000 was too repetitive towards the end.

3+ Twisted Sonic rev

big no-no.

Even 1 more second to the combo could have been all it needed. What I mean is I didn't get a good sense of finality at the end of the combo, it just stops abruptly. One more solid ending trick would've really made a big difference.

A 10sec limit has always suited UPSB battles well, I've no idea why battle videos nowadays have to be more than 10sec.
If you can't show your full potential in 10sec, then obviously you aren't such a good spinner after all.

@putfile: heh. I hate the loading that I have to go through everytime I want to watch the video again.

concision

It really depends on your style of spinning. Lots of people favor complicated charge and pass combos. The difficulty of the combo is determined by smooth and difficult linkage rather than difficulty of the individual tricks, in which case one would need a longer amount of time to show their skill in trick linkage.

why is this in the spammer's bin?

because I locked the real thread in the battlezone. I'll move it, was my mistake to begin with...

I just checked the locked thread...haha what a shit-show. I do feel bad for LB because his combo was good. What im guessing happened is that judge 3 just didnt understand zombo's system enough and as a result...well everyone knows what happened. Dont let this get you down LB, better luck(?) next time

I don't see why, now everyone seems to agree there was a mistake, why LordBojo should have to make another video... It's not his fault the judge was a fag. The videos cannot be simply re-judged?

So I can make a 2hr video to show how good I am?

@faulk: That doesn't make sense. If a person is using hard tricks but cannot link them well, no matter how long a person may film, it's not really going to capture the smooth and difficult linkage that you are looking for in a clip.

@Tay: So are you saying that you don't have good linking? Two hrs is how long it takes in hopes that something good will appear?
Yes, I know what you posted is not for real. You were trying to prove a point.



ON TOPIC:
The videos would have to be redone because any discrepancy invalidates the entire match. =/

Still a bit late for that...

I'm pretty sure the results of the next video will be biased because people are afraid to get Bojo angry. :ssst:

I don't think you got what I was saying. I mean that some videos like bojo's are good because they showcase an excellent and hard trick or minicombo. Other videos are good because they show fast and excellent linkage but the tricks may not necessarily be hard. I'm saying that a video showcasing a single trick is usually better when its short, but videos that focus on smoothness and speed (and less difficult tricks) usually require a bit more time to develop than videos showing a single new trick/minicombo.

wow LB hasn't commented in this thread yet

But when he does...it will be a wave of curses and rage :lol:

So a palmspin 6 000 000 wouldn't give extra points on difficulty? What about a flawlessly caught Triple Infinity Release 2 000?

Anyone know J03's home adress? :sniper:

he's just saying, some combos are deemed difficult because they have difficult tricks, some combos are difficult becasue the linkage is hard.

So the best of both worlds is to have difficult tricks linked together in hard ways :)

So I've had a bit of a re-evalution.

Bojo wins on creativity.
I would say difficulty is tied.
Smoothness slight advantage 000.
Speed is tied.
Filming advantage 000.

So I give slight win to 000 on this one by the judging system.

It doesn't matter which combo I prefer personally, the scoring system dictates the winner, not which combo looks better.

Yup, and that is how judging videos work.

Always by technicality to indicate fairness.

Ah, but that contradicts what you said earlier:

Will you bite the bullet and say that a biased vote can still be fair or will you take a direct hit?

LOL, although it was a good reference, his statement doenst need to be either....

he's saying that the judging system is based around technicalities so that its still fair. but that doesnt mean that the judges wont abuse their powers and skew the results. in which case it would be biased and unfair.

no flame at all I'm an adult I can talk seriously
But tell me because it seem sthat I'm the only one to feel things like that, maybe I'm weird

please tell me what was new in this combo...
pleaqe tell me, maybe I'm blind but Ta -> palmspin is a often-used combo and fl ta rev -> rev palmspin has often been done too.
So, the tricks are not new and the linkages are not new.

for 000, maybe tricks were not that new but some linkages were hard and pretty well done.

Hey it's not a matter of style, I have big respect for what Bojo has brought in UPSB in the I-tricks technics but dont tell me that this judge is biased...

guys, time to wake up, or maybe it's me who 's still asleep. don't know.
But I don't like this way to idolize guys just for what they have done in this way.
You can surely idolize bojo for what he has done, no problem to me.

But the fact is that you bring this idolization in the middle of a battle of the moment. That's not the judge who is biased, it's your almighty devotion to bojo.

Because of that, you're saying judge 3 is cheating. A battle is a battle, you have to respect people who have been chosen to be judges.

It's not against you bojo, time has changed, I dont want to start a flaming conversation.

Let's say that differently, if it was Kam and there were a battle Kam/Eriror, Eriror surely could win anyway because time has passed and even if Kam is a legend, there's some much tricks he doesn't approach.

But I'm sure that it would be Kam who would win because there's all a legend behind him.

Please let aside your state of mind about battler and please give scores for REAL originality and REAL creativity.

please, is there someone who think like me? I'm feeling a bit alone ...

sorry I wasn't referring to Bojo's combo, I was talking about old UPSB videos in general.

BTW it's not really about the judge being biased, it's that the judge didn't understand how the system worked at all, so the point difference make the judge look biased.

yeah but even with an average note (which could be better for sure because you keep the proportion), it's still fair.

when i finally forced myself to read ur giant post, i agree w/ you completely.


but judge 3 was still wrong. the judging system is like zombo set up, to give someone +3, the other person would have to like drop the pen or something rediculous like that. The scoring was unfair. HOWEVER, bojo didnt deserve to win this battle.

Hmm.. I can't say I've ever seen ta -> palmspin -> fl ta rev -> rev palmspin before. Hmm, 000's combo.. I can pull up about 50 videos on the spot that look exactly like it.

then you need to pay more attention is all i can say <_<

okay let's analyse your point of view.

Let's take a combo of Eriror, one in the championship for example.

Anyone here in UCPSB has looked at a lot of combo of Eriror, right?

so if you take another combo of him, you will say surely, "hmmm I have seen those linkages, somewhere, it's like all Eriror's combo".

Okay, it's a point of view, I respect it.

now , I personnaly challenge Eriror ( who would have done a 25 s video pretty nice as usual).

And my combo is a 3 s combo where I do TA -> palmspin -> FL ta rev, rev palmspin and a final TA rev,

will you still say that because of the fact I've done a TA rev at the end, it's just original so, of course, this combo is better than Eriror's.

You guys, have a strange sight about creativity in penspinning.
I have talked about it in my blog but it's in french so I will translate it here.

It seems that a spinner has to do something very visual (like that kamehameha thingies) to be original.

it seems that otherwise, a spinner is non creative.

Please, creativity exist in penspinning but, i'm sorry to say it, not on this board, I mean not visually, I know that the research department do a lot in syntax.

I'm on my knees to give you the advice to take windows movie maker and to open some vids of Angmaramyon, Key3, Ayatori, Bonito, Taeryong...

The fact is that the reaction is like that "I dont understand what he does, fucking korean style, they're good but it all looks the same "

Maybe it looks the same, dont want to criticize your sight, but please breakdown what they did, I can assure you THAT is creativity in the linkages and in the tricks.

Anyway, I'm sure that I will be insulted for my state of mind but that's my point of view, please respect it.

I agree with you 100%. In UCPSB people (well some more than others <_<) try too hard to be "creative". Its starting to get freaking rediculous.

Probably not. That's taking things to the extreme. Bojo was given the edge on creativity (i.e. not the overall score) because what he did was seen less often than what many other people do and hence was deemd more creative. If you just copy masses of other videos, then how is that creative?

Nope, not at all. It's important to differentiate between "visual" and "flashy" however. What you described is more flashy, whereas visual refers to how well the combo looked overall. You don't have to go as far as invent a trick to be original. You just have to think outside the box and try to do things that not many people do. Changing the order of the tricks isn't very creative, but that is exactly what most videos seem to show these days. Being creative is the ability to create something unique enough to hold the attention of your audience without boring them.

Wow, if you read my posts you'd realize that I too respect that some combos rely on smooth trick linking too. I am NOT turning this stupid debate into a flame against korean/smooth style. Ayatori, Taeryong, yes their combo's are damn sweet, but guess what, i'm not looking at them. I'm looking at the INDIVIDUAL videos in front of my face, not rookee's or anybody's legacy, and I can tell you right off that rookee's combo was way more memorable. I don't see how doing rookee's combo is "freaking ridiculous" as you say strat. Sure you can prance around and say "Oo, the tricks are so easy I can copy it in a week" as if anybody could have thought of it. Well nobody friggen' did, which is why it's "creative."


I respect your opinion Frat, but I think we're arguing over something different. This is MY opinion, sorry if offended anybody.

Edit: BTW, i'm not trying to defend rookee or anything like that, in my first post I said he should have tied or lost by a little. I just changed this to say he should have tied or won by a little. I won't say the vids are even, but it's hard to say which would have won (like i said before, if rookee had a more satisfying finish, i would've supported his vid more).

Edit: took out that (not) since i'm feeling slightly better now..

did you read what HE said?
doing things that no one has done before =/= creative
doing it well in a flowing combo like bojo did is
i could do thumbsnap > kamehameha off a wall > pen twirl > t3 around > t2 around > middlearound release > catch > armroll
with a breaks between each trick so it still looks like crap